ratkke2013-06-17 22:58:14
IT education
ratkke, 2013-06-17 22:58:14

Again. Choosing a university?

Good day to all, of course, on Habré, the question of choosing a university for a future programmer has been raised more than once or twice. There have been two of them this month alone . Actually, I started to deal with this issue six months before the exam, so I more or less studied it. But I did not make a choice, your advice is very much needed. To begin with, about myself: I passed the exam with 270 points (84 Russian, 94 computer science, 92 mathematics), there is an opportunity to go to a paid form of education. I want to study at a university, and not go to parties, I’m ready to plow. I did not pass the exam in physics. There was no programming at school, as well as computer science, there were no tutors. Worked on edx and coursera . And, of course, math textbooks. I also watched various lessons on codeforces.ru. Actually, I would like to participate in acm at the university and attend training. I am aware that special groups are created at all faculties, where only Olympiads are taken, and they train there. I'm not an olympiad, so I won't get there. Therefore, the “openness” of all these processes will be very important.
I found 3 options for myself - MIPT FIVT, SPbGU MATMEH (Matobes direction) and HSE PI.
Let's start with the first - I don’t go there by points, so only for a paid one (not a problem). It is embarrassing that in order to transfer to a free one, you need to pass both sessions with excellent or good results. It’s embarrassing - because they say (the students themselves) that it’s very difficult to study, and the students there are basically all sorts of Olympiads (which I don’t belong to), so I’m afraid not to understand everything straight on 4 or 5. It’s also embarrassing that I just won’t pull my studies, more precisely level will not be mine initially. Is this fear justified or will I teach everyone “in a new way”? It attracts that the departments are directly connected with the future employer, that they give up-to-date knowledge, and that if you still pull your studies there, you will be trained in the highest class.
Matmeh - his main disadvantage is that he is in St. Petersburg (I myself am from Tver), and more precisely in Peterhof, it will be difficult to go home. It is also embarrassing that, perhaps, St. Petersburg State University is not as valued by employers as the same Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology. Well, it’s also embarrassing that there is a lot of mathematics in the first courses. I know that a programmer must be a mathematician, but not to the detriment of programming itself. In the schedule of matobes clearlyit can be seen that the subject of programming is 1. That is, computer science in the first courses is much less than mathematics. But by points I pass there (the pass was 250). What attracts me is that after the 2nd year there are distributions among the departments, and there are many more IT subjects. It attracts me that I will have an excellent mathematical base, which is well (seemingly) Olympiad programming is well developed (you can safely go to training, I found out :) ). Mathematics also provides excellent fundamental education. Plus, there are various student projects, which I think are very cool (they were mentioned on Habré )
PI HSE. Undoubtedly, I really like that there are strong languages. That lectures from the 2nd year, some are read in English. Everything is modern. However, the hostel is very far from the university itself, and you will need to stay on the road for about 2-3 hours a day. Plus, even PI has an economy. And I just hate her. Even when they say something about the economy in the news, it annoys me. I don't know why. Well and still, in PI just mathematics is not enough. Much less than at MATMEKH and less than at MIPT. I believe that a good programmer needs a good mathematical base, or better, even an excellent one.
Well, that's all, I honestly don't know what to choose, my heart lies with all 3 faculties. I hope you can help me with good advice. I really hope that there will be those who studied / study at one of these faculties.
PSI read an article on PI HSE.
ZYY I would also like to have various courses that you can attend at the university or somewhere nearby. So, in Moscow it is ShAD, in St. Petersburg it is a CS center. The Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology has additional courses on python (I asked), the HSE also has various additional courses (judging by the article).

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5 answer(s)
Yaroslav Astafiev, 2013-06-18

Regarding the MIPT FIVT and the direction of PMI at the physicist as a whole. Informatics as such will not teach you so much, upon completion of the university you will receive an overview of knowledge, which in my opinion is very good. Personally, I don’t like that the PMI has a “non-Physical Engineering Education” that cuts out many items that I think are necessary. The advantage of physics and technology will be: if you are really interested in programming, then there are a large number of specials for you. courses, group classes, opportunities to participate in various projects (both educational and non-educational). At this university! if you want, you can get almost any skill (and not just basic ones).
Regarding studies: yes, it will be difficult, but if you do everything systematically, there will be no problems, but “self-organization” and other necessary qualities will grow. If you teach and take everything into a session, then you need to be persistent and stress-resistant (which is also not bad). True, in the second case, there is a great chance to fly out. In general, if you want, you can crawl out to the desired level, it seems that they read additional school chapters in mathematics and physics to facilitate understanding.
I would add one more thing to the problems of the Physicotechnical Institute: if you studied at an unremarkable school, then at first you will go nuts, because 80% of the students quickly grasp everything, do it, and think (many of which will be terrible slobs). if you were a superstar at school, won prizes at olympiads, and so on, then when you come to physics and technology you will have to accept that you are far from being the smartest, and most of you are like that here.

Andrei Vurtatov, 2013-06-17

Even when they say something about the economy in the news, it annoys me. I don't know why. Well and still, in PI just mathematics is not enough. Much less than at MATMEKH and less than at MIPT. I believe that a good programmer needs a good mathematical base, or better, even an excellent one.

1. There was a similar attitude towards the economy (1 to 1, even wiped away a tear). During the training, it has changed dramatically and now the second higher education will most likely be economic.
2. Our mathematicians often give perhaps more than necessary. True, I'm talking about faculties, where you are also a “mathematician” at the exit. A programmer needs a mathematical base, but such faculties train scientists rather than programmers. It's hard to explain, but it's true.
3. Additional courses: it seems to me that with a courser and other things, it is easier to study on your own. There are courses, but you will meet a really COOL teacher only a couple of times during your studies.
In general advice. Don't chase math. A bunch of theoretical mathematics will pump your brains a little, but in essence you may not find its application (in full). And the volume in which you will use it will cause you to laugh.
It is better to simultaneously learn something that you do not understand at all. For example the economy. Believe me, a good programmer + economist is even more appreciated. As in principle, and any related specialties.
Programming. Everything can be learned by yourself. To put it simply, programming is much easier to learn on your own. Therefore, faculties in which programming is mainly (and let's say higher mathematics in one subject for 2 semesters) are also not ok. Unfortunately, almost everywhere we have a bias either towards mathematics (“Oh, why is your programming there, read a book at home, here’s a terver passed, I understand that!”) Or programming (where they explain the essence of a bunch of languages ​​\u200b\u200boften not in the best way).
In general, Russian education is lame in several places at once:
Teaching staff. I have seen graduate students who explain the material perfectly. I have seen professors from the Russian Academy of Sciences who can be used as sleeping pills. For some reason, teaching in our country is mainly for services to science (or the desire to receive these merits in the future), a kind of sacrifice, the minimum wage, etc. But status. I took many courses on the courser and the same yudasity and I'm really offended. The people who teach there are (again, as far as I can tell) who have talent. And for some reason, we don’t understand that to be a teacher, you also need to be able to explain. And not just monotonously lecture from a book (even if you wrote it yourself).
Scientific approach. They don't train specialists in some field, they train scientists. I'm not sure I made it clear, but you might come across this again.
Too wide profile. We are preparing "jack of all trades". And this is not correct. As a result, even after a good faculty of a good university, if all you did was study hard, you can become more of a researcher than a valuable specialist in the field.
Too difficult/high pace in the early courses. 15% of the course passes the exam on the first try? A third is deducted for the first year? This is quite a standard situation for many departments. The question is, why (or maybe for what? :) )?
By the way, there is another option. Go to a mediocre it department and study for fun. Spend your free time self-learning what you really want. Perhaps, if I had the opportunity to return to the past (while retaining my friends and memory, perhaps), I would have done so.

simbajoe, 2013-06-17

I don’t know, I would go to the Fiztekh and not think about it. Especially if the geeks are hunting and don't have to work while studying. Perhaps an incomplete gestalt is speaking in me. And there is nothing to be afraid of with such scores (even if for the Unified State Examination).

[email protected]><e, 2013-06-18

I am a student of Math-Mech at St. Petersburg State University (not yet an Olympiad), so I’ll tell you from my belfry:
About the value of Math-Mech among employers is a very, very strange statement. In all well-known offices of St. Petersburg (JetBrains, EMC, Yandex, Google, Oracle, HP) you can find a bunch of MatMech graduates. Empirical observations show that this is especially true of Oracle, which ate Sun, which had a development center in St. Petersburg (where, according to rumors, all Java is developed), very conveniently located for MM students. On the other hand, no one is really interested in an abstract MM graduate - the only question is what is in your head (and with a certain degree of resourcefulness, apparently, you can end MM by ignoring almost everything).
However, not everything is so smooth: lectures on computer science given in the first year, in their current form, are a rare muck (this is about mathematical software, if anything, I don’t presume to judge about other specialties) and are not recommended for visiting. Practice is another matter, then how lucky and how you get out. There are fig teachers, there are cool ones. If you are not lucky to get to the cool ones, then you can just go to their couples and take homework - usually no one is against it. You can transfer to another group. There is a lot of different mathematics, yes. Perhaps even more than necessary. Not all teachers are equally good, but you can live. Yes, and to informatics in programming specialties, write down discrete mathematics. Although this is mathematics, it is much more important and close to the activities of a programmer than any kind of mat. analyzes and topologies.
Another fly in the ointment is the territorial remoteness of MM from St. Petersburg: getting to the nearest metro station by train costs 30 rubles and 45 minutes of your life, or 70 rubles. + 40 minutes of life in case of using a minibus. There is another option with a student pass and a bus, but it is even more time consuming.
In addition to the mentioned student projects, every summer there is a summer school (they say there are also winter ones), during which students cool off under air conditioners for several weeks and comprehend the Tao of development in close to real conditions.
Not so long ago, JetBrains opened their laboratory on Mat-Mech . EMC, Digital Design, HP also cooperate with mat-fur.

Here I already wrote a long passage about the ShAD and the CS-center, but then I noticed that you are already aware of it.

Rast1234, 2013-06-23

If you are considering universities in other cities, there is also MathMech Ural State University, in Yekaterinburg, now called IMCS UrFU. I am a third-year student here, majoring in computer science. If interested, I can describe the faculty and training in more detail, tell more about the city.
Briefly about my studies: I like everything, everything is cool, it’s not a problem to enter with such points, students actively participate in ACM, there is also a HackerDom club (computer security, RuCTF competitions are held), there is a robotics laboratory (google - Eurobot competitions), students with 2- 3 students work quietly or train in IT companies of the city, some companies cooperate with the faculty (SKB Kontur, Naumen, Ideco).
Briefly about the city: it is not very busy, unlike Moscow, prices are lower on average, in general the city is quite compact, well, in general, it is always good at home, I can write a lot of other things about my native places that are not relevant :)

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